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Offline Gigaview

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Structural Realism
« Online: 19 de Janeiro de 2012, 21:41:45 »
Structural Realism
by Amanda Gefter - Consultant, New Scientist; Founding Editor, CultureLab"

Structural realism—in its metaphysical version, championed by the philosopher of science James Ladyman—is the deepest explanation I know, because it serves as a kind of meta-explanation, one that explains the nature of reality and the nature of scientific explanations.

The idea behind structural realism is pretty simple: the world isn't made of things, it's made of mathematical relationships, or structure. A mathematical structure is a set of isomorphic elements, each of which can be perfectly mapped onto the next. To give a trivial example, the numbers 25 and 52 share the same mathematical structure.

When the philosopher John Worrall first introduced structural realism (though he attributes it to physicist Henri Poincaré), he was trying to explain something puzzling: how was it possible that a scientific theory that would later turn out to be wrong could still manage to make accurate predictions? Take Newtonian gravity. Newton said that gravity was a force that masses exert on one another from a distance. That idea was overthrown by Einstein, who showed that gravity was the curvature of spacetime. Given how wrong Newton was about gravity, it seems almost miraculous that he was able to accurately predict the motions of the planets.

Thankfully, we don't have to resort to miracles. Newton may have gotten the physical interpretation of gravity wrong, but he got a piece of the math right. That's why, at weak masses and small velocities, Einstein's equations reduce to Newton's. The problem, Worrall pointed out, was that we mistook an interpretation of the theory for the theory itself. The fact is, in physics, theories are sets of equations, and nothing more. "Quantum field theory" is a group of mathematical structures. "Electrons" are little stories we tell ourselves.

These days, believing in the reality of objects—of physical things like particles, fields, forces, even spacetime geometries—can quickly lead to profound existential crises.

Quantum theory, for instance, strips particles of any sense of "thingness". One electron is not merely similar to another, all electrons are exactly the same. Electrons have no inherent identity—a fact that makes quantum statistics drastically different from the classical kind. Anyone who believes that an electron is a "thing" in its own right is bound to lose big in a quantum casino.

Meanwhile, all of nature's fundamental forces, including electromagnetism and the nuclear forces that operate deep in the cores of atoms, are described by gauge theory, which shows that forces aren't physical things in the world, but discrepancies in different descriptions of the world, in different observers' points of view. Gravity is a gauge force too, which means you can make it blink out of existence just by changing your frame of reference. In fact, that was Einstein's "happiest thought": a person in freefall can't feel their weight. It's often said that you can't disobey the law of gravity, but the truth is you can take it out with a simple coordinate change.

Recent advances in theoretical physics have only made the situation worse. The holographic principle tells us that our four-dimensional spacetime and everything in it is exactly equivalent to physics taking place on the two-dimensional boundary of the universe. Neither description is more "real" than the other—one can be perfectly mapped onto the other with no loss of information. When we try to believe that spacetime is really four-dimensional or really has a particular geometry, the holographic principle pulls the rug out from under us.

The physical nature of reality has been further eroded by M-theory, the theory that many physicists believe can unite general relativity and quantum mechanics. M-theory encompasses five versions of string theory (plus one non-stringy theory known as supergravity) all of which are related by mathematical maps called dualities. What looks like a strong interaction in one theory looks like a weak interaction in another. What look like eleven dimensions in one theory look like ten in another. Big can look like small, strings can look like particles. Virtually any object you can think of will be transformed into something totally different as you move from one theory to the next—and yet, somehow, all of the theories are equally true.

This reality crisis has grown so dire that Stephen Hawking has called for a kind of philosophical surrender, a white flag he terms "model-dependent realism", which basically says that while our theoretical models offer possible descriptions of the world, we'll simply never know the true reality that lies beneath. Perhaps there is no reality at all.

But structural realism offers a way out. An explanation. A reality. The only catch is that it's not made of physical objects. Then again, our theories never said it was. Electrons aren't real, but the mathematical structure of quantum field theory is. Gauge forces aren't real, but the symmetry groups that describe them are. The dimensions, geometries and even strings described by any given string theory aren't real—what's real are the mathematical maps that transform one string theory into another.

Of course, it's only human to want to interpret mathematical structure. There's a reason that "42" is hardly a satisfying answer to life, the universe and everything. We want to know what the world is really like, but we want it in a form that fits our intuitions. A form that means something. And for our narrative-driven brains, meaning comes in the form of stories, stories about things. I doubt we'll ever stop telling stories about how the universe works, and I, for one, am glad. We just have to remember not to mistake the stories for reality.

Structural realism forces us to radically revise the way we think about the universe. But it also provides a powerful explanation for some of the most mystifying aspects of physics. Without it, we'd have to give up on the notion that scientific theories can ever tell us how the world really is. And that, in my humble opinion, makes it a pretty beautiful explanation.

http://edge.org/responses/what-is-your-favorite-deep-elegant-or-beautiful-explanation
Brandolini's Bullshit Asymmetry Principle: "The amount of effort necessary to refute bullshit is an order of magnitude bigger than to produce it".

Pavlov probably thought about feeding his dogs every time someone rang a bell.

Offline Moro

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Re:Structural Realism
« Resposta #1 Online: 19 de Janeiro de 2012, 21:59:45 »
Não de uma maneira tão eloquente mas


Uns posts que coloquei sobre esse assunto há um ano...

...
Quando se fala em buracos de minhoca, energia escura e congêneres, me parecem entidades criadas para explicar observações de eventos que estamos anos luz de conhecer. Nem sei se temos vocabulário para descrever os acontecimentos. Me parece que antes temos que resolver um problema de metáfora: sempre vejo físicos na discovery buscando conceitos no nosso cotidiano para explicar esses fenômenos e o Hawking faz isso também.
Não creio que é só para explicar ao leigo.
Então, o fenômeno acaba tendo sentido apenas na linguagem da matemática. Aí ao interpretarmos caimos em questões como a luz ser onda e partícula ao mesmo tempo, um eletron estar em dois lugares ao mesmo tempo... Me parece não haver capacidade de vocabulário/abstração ao nosso alcance agora.
...

e esse


...
Sempre achei interessante: o tempo é uma convenção humana mas ele se dilata... E ainda leva as bolinhas de gude soltas... Veja a metáfora do nosso cotidiano.

...


A física moderna claramente tem um problema de metáfora e de vocabulário. Tenho para comigo que questões como incerteza (gato morto e vivo) e outras questões são frutos de uma confusão causada apenas pela nossa incapacidade de encontrar correlatos ao universo quântico dentro do nosso mundo cotidiano.

A física moderna claramente tem um problema de metáfora e de vocabulário. Tenho para comigo que questões como incerteza (gato morto e vivo) e outras questões são frutos de uma confusão causada apenas pela nossa incapacidade de encontrar correlatos ao universo quântico dentro do nosso mundo cotidiano.

Boa! Ótimo argumento para usar com fãs do filme What a fuck do we know. Eles apenas levam ao pé da letra uma metáfora.

Perfeito!

Da época que eu tinha cérebro para postar  :biglol:
“If an ideology is peaceful, we will see its extremists and literalists as the most peaceful people on earth, that's called common sense.”

Faisal Saeed Al Mutar


"To claim that someone is not motivated by what they say is motivating them, means you know what motivates them better than they do."

Peter Boghossian

Sacred cows make the best hamburgers

I'm not convinced that faith can move mountains, but I've seen what it can do to skyscrapers."  --William Gascoyne

Offline Gigaview

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Re:Structural Realism
« Resposta #2 Online: 19 de Janeiro de 2012, 22:05:45 »
Interessante.  :ok: Nem me lembrava mais disso. :vergonha:
Brandolini's Bullshit Asymmetry Principle: "The amount of effort necessary to refute bullshit is an order of magnitude bigger than to produce it".

Pavlov probably thought about feeding his dogs every time someone rang a bell.

Offline Moro

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Re:Structural Realism
« Resposta #3 Online: 19 de Janeiro de 2012, 22:21:41 »
da época que eu tinha cérebro para postar?
“If an ideology is peaceful, we will see its extremists and literalists as the most peaceful people on earth, that's called common sense.”

Faisal Saeed Al Mutar


"To claim that someone is not motivated by what they say is motivating them, means you know what motivates them better than they do."

Peter Boghossian

Sacred cows make the best hamburgers

I'm not convinced that faith can move mountains, but I've seen what it can do to skyscrapers."  --William Gascoyne

Offline genjikhan

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Re:Structural Realism
« Resposta #4 Online: 19 de Janeiro de 2012, 22:35:41 »
Então a estrutura que permite a existência da realidade nada mais é que a Matemática,segundo o ponto de vista de uma ideia dessa?
"Não há fatos eternos,assim como não há verdades absolutas" - Friederich Nietzsche

"Os males de que padece o ser humano vêm em seu maior número,vêm dele mesmo" - Plínio

"Quem conhece a sua ignorância revela a mais profunda sapiência. Quem ignora a sua ignorância vive na mais profunda ilusão" - Lao Tsé

Offline Moro

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Re:Structural Realism
« Resposta #5 Online: 19 de Janeiro de 2012, 22:37:45 »
errado.

O que permite a interpretação da realidade é a matemática. Leia o texto.
“If an ideology is peaceful, we will see its extremists and literalists as the most peaceful people on earth, that's called common sense.”

Faisal Saeed Al Mutar


"To claim that someone is not motivated by what they say is motivating them, means you know what motivates them better than they do."

Peter Boghossian

Sacred cows make the best hamburgers

I'm not convinced that faith can move mountains, but I've seen what it can do to skyscrapers."  --William Gascoyne

Offline Gigaview

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Re:Structural Realism
« Resposta #6 Online: 19 de Janeiro de 2012, 22:42:21 »
errado.

O que permite a interpretação da realidade é a matemática. Leia o texto.
:amira:
Brandolini's Bullshit Asymmetry Principle: "The amount of effort necessary to refute bullshit is an order of magnitude bigger than to produce it".

Pavlov probably thought about feeding his dogs every time someone rang a bell.

Offline Moro

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Re:Structural Realism
« Resposta #7 Online: 19 de Janeiro de 2012, 22:49:25 »
previa o que?
“If an ideology is peaceful, we will see its extremists and literalists as the most peaceful people on earth, that's called common sense.”

Faisal Saeed Al Mutar


"To claim that someone is not motivated by what they say is motivating them, means you know what motivates them better than they do."

Peter Boghossian

Sacred cows make the best hamburgers

I'm not convinced that faith can move mountains, but I've seen what it can do to skyscrapers."  --William Gascoyne

Offline Gigaview

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Re:Structural Realism
« Resposta #8 Online: 19 de Janeiro de 2012, 22:52:08 »
previa o que?

Misinterpretation. Está ficando recorrente.
Brandolini's Bullshit Asymmetry Principle: "The amount of effort necessary to refute bullshit is an order of magnitude bigger than to produce it".

Pavlov probably thought about feeding his dogs every time someone rang a bell.

Offline Moro

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Re:Structural Realism
« Resposta #9 Online: 20 de Janeiro de 2012, 00:03:00 »
aconteceu o mesmo em outro tópico que estou debatendo com ele. Leitura.
“If an ideology is peaceful, we will see its extremists and literalists as the most peaceful people on earth, that's called common sense.”

Faisal Saeed Al Mutar


"To claim that someone is not motivated by what they say is motivating them, means you know what motivates them better than they do."

Peter Boghossian

Sacred cows make the best hamburgers

I'm not convinced that faith can move mountains, but I've seen what it can do to skyscrapers."  --William Gascoyne

 

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