Autor Tópico: OVNIs - tópico oficial  (Lida 17966 vezes)

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Offline Gigaview

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Re:OVNIs - tópico oficial
« Resposta #150 Online: 22 de Maio de 2017, 18:34:27 »
Sim, mas também pode ser usada como salão de festas pressurizado quando dotada de uma plataforma/piso retrátil. Acho que no dia a dia deve ser usada mesmo como imenso holofote, extremamente útil nos casos de abdução de seres vivos em pesquisas de campo interplanetárias.
Brandolini's Bullshit Asymmetry Principle: "The amount of effort necessary to refute bullshit is an order of magnitude bigger than to produce it".

Pavlov probably thought about feeding his dogs every time someone rang a bell.

Offline Buckaroo Banzai

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Re:OVNIs - tópico oficial
« Resposta #151 Online: 22 de Maio de 2017, 19:14:13 »
Eu particularmente acho mais preocupante a presença de nano-OVNIs e micro-OVNIs miméticos, disfarçados de insetos.

Para mim está claro que a tecnologia shape-shifter dos fake airplanes objetiva nos distrair desses mecanismos que nos observam de mais perto, e nos inoculam com doenças.

A tecnologia de microscopificação também explica mais satisfatoriamente a maior parte das abduções ocorridas desde os anos 70, bem como avistamentos de alienígenas e desaparecimento. Reduzindo o tamanho dos abduzidos, e/ou o próprio, simplesmente não gera as mesmas evidências de macroabdução e macro-ocultação. Mesmo incluindo teletransporte.

Offline Gigaview

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Re:OVNIs - tópico oficial
« Resposta #152 Online: 22 de Maio de 2017, 20:10:07 »
Outro dia, durante uma viagem de final de semana na serra, ví mosquitos voando em formação semelhante àquela utilizada por patos em migração. Devia ter de 20 a 30 unidades. Fizeram um vôo aparentemente de reconhecimento em torno de um vaso de samambaia e se dispersaram dois a dois seguindo rotas retilíneas em todas as direções numa velocidade fantástica.

Outro caso aconteceu há muitos anos com uma abelha que tentava passar pelo vidro da janela batendo nela sem parar. Do lado de dentro comecei a bater o dedo onde a abelha insistia em entrar mas de repente ela desistiu e desapareceu e retornei para a mesa onde realizava um trabalho no computador. Minutos depois, para minha surpresa lá estava a abelha de novo, agora do lado de dentro parada na minha frente feito um helicóptero. Então o pequeno "inseto" fez um tonneaux seguido de um pull-pull-Humpty-Bump para então realizar um lazy eight em vôo invertido. Quando ela ameaçou fazer um oito cubano invertido peguei uma raquete anti-insetos e eletrocutei aquele pequeno Alberto Bertelli sem piedade. Até hoje fico pensando que tipo mensagem estava querendo me passar.
Brandolini's Bullshit Asymmetry Principle: "The amount of effort necessary to refute bullshit is an order of magnitude bigger than to produce it".

Pavlov probably thought about feeding his dogs every time someone rang a bell.

Offline Buckaroo Banzai

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Re:OVNIs - tópico oficial
« Resposta #153 Online: 22 de Maio de 2017, 20:21:50 »
Os céticos por muitos anos gargalhavam da hipótese das abelhas usarem uma linguagem, até que uma equipe de cientistas os calou, desvendando o código da dança das abelhas, e podendo inclusive comandá-las com um modelo rudimentar de abelha-robô.

https://www.newscientist.com/article/mg21128264-600-robobee-speaks-honeybee-dance-language/



A "abelha" no centro, borrada por movimento, é a "robobelha" feita pelos pesquisadores.


Imagine o que civilizações com tecnologia de viagem intergalática não são capazes em termos de zootelepatia, seja biológica ou instrumental.

O "mainstream" científico ainda fica coçando a cabeça com o mistério da morte das abelhas, lhes restando apenas concluir que a resposta é "um pouco de tudo"*. Menos exaustão por controle alienígena, claro.


* incluindo aquecimento global, mas sem colaboração do Sol ou qualquer outro fator extraterreno.

Offline Gigaview

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Re:OVNIs - tópico oficial
« Resposta #154 Online: 22 de Maio de 2017, 20:28:41 »
O mainstream científico é ridículo. Veja esta tese que tenta mascarar os micro-ufos como insetos.

Citar
Insects as unidentified flying objects


Abstract

Five species of insects were subjected to a large electric field. Each of the insects stimulated in this manner emitted visible glows of various colors and blacklight (uv). It is postulated that the Uintah Basin, Utah, nocturnal UFO display (1965–1968) was partially due to mass swarms of spruce budworms, Choristoneura fumiferana (Clemens), stimulated to emit this type of St. Elmo’s fire by flying into high electric fields caused by thunderheads and high density particulate matter in the air. There was excellent time and spatial correlation between the 1965–1968 UFO nocturnal sightings and spruce budworm infestation. It is suggested that a correlation of nocturnal UFO sightings throughout the U.S. and Canada with spruce budworm infestations might give some insight into nocturnal insect flight patterns.
https://www.osapublishing.org/ao/abstract.cfm?uri=ao-17-21-3355
Brandolini's Bullshit Asymmetry Principle: "The amount of effort necessary to refute bullshit is an order of magnitude bigger than to produce it".

Pavlov probably thought about feeding his dogs every time someone rang a bell.

Offline Buckaroo Banzai

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Re:OVNIs - tópico oficial
« Resposta #155 Online: 22 de Maio de 2017, 20:36:22 »




<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/hEZ7rHRifVc" target="_blank" class="new_win">https://www.youtube.com/v/hEZ7rHRifVc</a>

A própria universidade de Harvard admite estar estudando essa tecnologia, explorada em um nível muito mais avançado pelos alienígenas.

Os alienígenas a esta altura certamente já chegaram ao ponto de controlar insetos e outros organismos através de implantes de vírus de controle de comportamento, bem como controle remoto telepático, talvez assistido por vírus ou outros microorganismos parasitas.

Offline Gigaview

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Re:OVNIs - tópico oficial
« Resposta #156 Online: 22 de Maio de 2017, 21:26:50 »
Jung já desconfiava disso tudo...

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Even the famous Swiss psychoanalyst Prof. Carl Jung had considered such a prospect, noting in 1961: "I must confess that in reading the numerous UFO relations I also came up with the idea that the characteristic behaviour of UFOs resembles especially that of certain insects".
http://karlshuker.blogspot.com.br/2017/02/ufo-logical-encounters-of-insect-kind.html
Brandolini's Bullshit Asymmetry Principle: "The amount of effort necessary to refute bullshit is an order of magnitude bigger than to produce it".

Pavlov probably thought about feeding his dogs every time someone rang a bell.

Offline Johnny Cash

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Re:OVNIs - tópico oficial
« Resposta #157 Online: 22 de Maio de 2017, 22:01:39 »
Mas é muito engraçado mesmo o comportamento histérico desses pseudo-céticos.

Alienígenas não precisam controlar os insetos de forma alguma, se eles já forem os próprios insetos. A ciência, dos céticos, não consegue criar do nada ou da pedra como dizem ter acontecido, nos seus laboratórios pomposos e gringos, uma formiguinha que seja. As diferenças anatômicas entre uma centopeia e um homem médio deixam claro, cuspido na cara, que não pode ter nada dessa conversinha governamental de ancestral comum (repito: nunca observou-se em laboratório, por mais experimentos que façam, uma mulher parir uma vespa).

Isso é apenas o que ELEs querem que a gente acredite e a legião de céticos de araque fica repetindo desvairadamente.

As evidências estão aí, múltiplas. O pior cego é aquele que não quer enxergar.

Mas aí vocês podem perguntar: Ok, como então eles fariam as viagens interplanetárias??? Pra isso a resposta também está na cara, muito clara, na ciência espírita. Espíritos de abelhas, borboletas e mariposas podem com tranquilidade fazer as viagens intergaláticas sem preocupar em morrer pelas adversidades espaciais, se materializando apenas aqui em solo terrestre em corpos de médiuns insecto-morfos que rapidamente fariam o serviço da reprodução da espécie.

Câmbio.

Offline Gigaview

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Re:OVNIs - tópico oficial
« Resposta #158 Online: 22 de Maio de 2017, 22:25:34 »
Não consigo ver qualquer relação disso com o espiritismo ou com a mediunidade. Podemos até considerar a metamorfose das borboletas e mariposas como uma metáfora para a reencarnação mas daí sugerir a materialização de espíritos de insetos em corpos de médiuns insectomorfos é inapropriado considerando a absoluta ausência de evidências disso. Acho que a questão envolve mais tecnologia do que faculdades espíritointelectuais.

Can you read me?
« Última modificação: 22 de Maio de 2017, 22:30:29 por Gigaview »
Brandolini's Bullshit Asymmetry Principle: "The amount of effort necessary to refute bullshit is an order of magnitude bigger than to produce it".

Pavlov probably thought about feeding his dogs every time someone rang a bell.

Offline Johnny Cash

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Re:OVNIs - tópico oficial
« Resposta #159 Online: 22 de Maio de 2017, 22:30:15 »
Não consigo ver qualquer relação disso com o espiritismo ou com a mediunidade. [...]

[...]
As evidências estão aí, múltiplas. O pior cego é aquele que não quer enxergar.
[...]

Offline Gigaview

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Re:OVNIs - tópico oficial
« Resposta #160 Online: 29 de Maio de 2017, 20:15:38 »
As mensagens deles começaram a chegar...




A message from an alien race? New Australian radio telescope finds mysterious 'fast radio burst' just four days after being switched on

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-4531832/Australian-radio-telescope-finds-rare-fast-radio-burst.html
Brandolini's Bullshit Asymmetry Principle: "The amount of effort necessary to refute bullshit is an order of magnitude bigger than to produce it".

Pavlov probably thought about feeding his dogs every time someone rang a bell.

Offline Buckaroo Banzai

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Re:OVNIs - tópico oficial
« Resposta #161 Online: 29 de Maio de 2017, 22:16:09 »
Vários insetos são de fato espécies vindas de biomas extraterrestres, como demonstrou Velikovsky.

Mas eles não têm, ao menos não evidentemente, invariavelmente uma inteligência de nível hominal. Por isso, apenas quando demonstrem um comportamento mais complexo, eles devem estar sendo controlados por espécies/espíritos superiores. Sendo seres aespirituais/não-tripulados ou com espíritos muito rudimentares no restante do tempo.

A ciência materialista postula até que os grupos de insetos componham o que eles chamam de "swarm intelligence", mas mesmo essa seria ainda algo perfeitamente dentro do degrau espírito-evolutivo dos reinos mineral, animal, vegetal, e peixal . Talvez até mesmo se fosse admitido o "upgrade" que representariam os campos mórficos de Sheldrake a essa inteligência coletiva ("representariam" pois a ciência pseudo-cética dogmática rejeita o fenômeno telepático).


Offline Brienne of Tarth

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Re:OVNIs - tópico oficial
« Resposta #162 Online: 30 de Maio de 2017, 11:39:49 »
Quase não consegui um link para essa notícia, mas ela está sendo difundida em várias redes sociais...a fonte original é o Daily Star, mas não consegui achar a matéria em tela.

"A notícia divulgada pelo tablóide britânico Daily Star parece mais com um filme de ficção cientifica. Segundo o jornal as principais lideranças mundiais sabem de uma invasão alienígena em setembro de 2017, que seria um ataque massivo. A publicação diz que o presidente russo Vladmir Putin já avisou da ação aos Estados Unidos.

Com a iminência do ataque o presidente russo Vladimir Putin teria pedido o apoio de Barack Obama – à época presidente dos EUA – para a construção de um sistema antimísseis. Essas informações teriam saído de um importante documento confidencial vazado do Kremlin, a respeito de uma reunião secreta entre Putin e o então vice-presidente dos EUA, Joe Biden.

Na última quinta-feira (18), um vídeo no Youtube – chamado US Warns Russia “Aliens On Their Way, Will Be Here In 2017 diz que o vice-presidente dos EUA teria recebido uma mensagem confidencial de Putin.
A mensagem, que foi entregue a Obama, declarava que Estados Unidos e Rússia poderiam cooperar na defesa do planeta em 2017.

O mesmo vídeo diz que a agência espacial norte-americana NASA já teria percebido a entrada dos OVNIs no espaço aéreo dos Estados Unidos e que o presidente da Rússia está em alerta, pois acredita que o ataque extraterrestre será devastador."


Segundo o "jornal", os aliens devem chegar à Terra em setembro desse ano.   :alien:

Invasão Alien 
« Última modificação: 30 de Maio de 2017, 11:42:30 por Brienne of Tarth »
GNOSE

Offline Gigaview

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Re:OVNIs - tópico oficial
« Resposta #163 Online: 30 de Maio de 2017, 13:09:52 »
Quase não consegui um link para essa notícia, mas ela está sendo difundida em várias redes sociais...a fonte original é o Daily Star, mas não consegui achar a matéria em tela.

"A notícia divulgada pelo tablóide britânico Daily Star parece mais com um filme de ficção cientifica. Segundo o jornal as principais lideranças mundiais sabem de uma invasão alienígena em setembro de 2017, que seria um ataque massivo. A publicação diz que o presidente russo Vladmir Putin já avisou da ação aos Estados Unidos.

Com a iminência do ataque o presidente russo Vladimir Putin teria pedido o apoio de Barack Obama – à época presidente dos EUA – para a construção de um sistema antimísseis. Essas informações teriam saído de um importante documento confidencial vazado do Kremlin, a respeito de uma reunião secreta entre Putin e o então vice-presidente dos EUA, Joe Biden.

Na última quinta-feira (18), um vídeo no Youtube – chamado US Warns Russia “Aliens On Their Way, Will Be Here In 2017 diz que o vice-presidente dos EUA teria recebido uma mensagem confidencial de Putin.
A mensagem, que foi entregue a Obama, declarava que Estados Unidos e Rússia poderiam cooperar na defesa do planeta em 2017.

O mesmo vídeo diz que a agência espacial norte-americana NASA já teria percebido a entrada dos OVNIs no espaço aéreo dos Estados Unidos e que o presidente da Rússia está em alerta, pois acredita que o ataque extraterrestre será devastador."


Segundo o "jornal", os aliens devem chegar à Terra em setembro desse ano.   :alien:

Invasão Alien 

Estamos salvos!!!!!!111!!!!







Citar
ASHTAR: “NO MORE ‘ALIEN INVASIONS!’ IN ALL OF THE EONS OF YOUR HISTORY, THIS IS THE MOMENT OF COMPLETE LIBERATION

Citação de: ASHTAR
You know, the Ides of March is tomorrow.***  They’d like nothing better than to have [quote-unquote]  an ‘alien invasion’ taking place.  But HELLO, we’ve told them and we’re telling them again, THAT IS NOT GOING TO HAPPEN, because you, Beloved Ones in this Ashtar On The Road Family, and the other Lightworkers of Planet Earth, have said ‘NO!!!  No more ‘alien invasions!’  We know that the Ashtar Command and all of the ones who are here now – well, almost all, the majority, with the greater powers – are here to assist in the Ascension of Planet Earth!’ – Ashtar

Ashtar delivers another stunning message via Susan Leland (reposted below), on these moments we are now in, of complete liberation… What does this mean?  Essentially, humans are free right now, but are living in ‘echoes’ of the past and future perceptions of slavery, since that’s what humanity has known for eons.  So it’s important for us to ‘clean up our energy bodies’ so that our souls can be fully and completely in our bodies… that’s what is needed.  Also what is needed, is for more humans to support the awakening and freedom of humanity… because so many are playing an old tape of reality, over and over… take a step outside, look to the skies, and ask for a visitation with your heart… keep the ball rolling some more! Many galactic messages are suggesting to humanity to no longer be distracted into the physical, and to get spiritual, so that we can be truly powerful!   –Indian in the machine
https://conspiracydailyupdate.com/category/investigations/false-flagswarning-322/false-flag-alien-invasionproject-bluebeamfail/


Obrigado Ashtar!!!!!



Brandolini's Bullshit Asymmetry Principle: "The amount of effort necessary to refute bullshit is an order of magnitude bigger than to produce it".

Pavlov probably thought about feeding his dogs every time someone rang a bell.

Offline Gigaview

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Re:OVNIs - tópico oficial
« Resposta #164 Online: 04 de Junho de 2017, 20:51:15 »
Ufos, Ets, Bigfoot, Mothman, etc são experimentos de engenharia social?

Quem ou o que está no controle?

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Jacques Vallee Discusses UFO Control System

Dr. Jacques Vallee, a French-American computer specialist with a background in astrophysics, once served as consultant to NASA's Mars Map project.

Jacques Vallee is one of ufology's major figures - and also its most original thinker.

Vallee, who holds a master's degree in astrophysics and a Ph.D. in computer science from Northwestern University, was an early scientific proponent of the theory that UFOs are extraterrestrial spaceships. His first book, Anatomy of a Phenomenon (Henry Regnery, 1965), argued eloquently that "through UFO activity … the contours of an amazingly complex intelligent life beyond the earth can already be discerned." In Challenge to Science - The UFO Enigma (Regnery, 1966) he and Janine Vallee (who is a psychologist by training, with a master's degree from the University of Paris) urged the scientific community to consider the UFO evidence in this light.

But by 1969, when he published Passport to Magonia (Regnery), Vallee's assessment of the UFO phenomenon had undergone a significant shift. Much to the consternation of the "scientific ufologists" who had seen him as one of their champions, Vallee now seemed to be backing away from the extraterrestrial hypotheses and advancing the radical view that UFOs are paranormal in nature and a modern space age manifestation of a phenomenon which assumes different guises in different historical contexts.

" When the underlying archetypes are extracted," he wrote, "the saucer myth is seen to coincide to a remarkable degree with the fairy-faith of Celtic countries … religious miracles… and the widespread belief among all peoples concerning entities whose physical and psychological descriptions place them in the same category as the present-day ufonauts."

In The Invisible College (E.P. Dutton, 1975) Vallee posits the idea of a "control system." UFOs and related phenomena are "the means through which man's concepts are being rearranged." Their ultimate source may be unknowable, at least at this stage of human development; what we do know, according to Vallee, is that they are presenting us with continually recurring "absurd" messages and appearances which defy rational analysis but which nonetheless address human beings on the level of myth and imagination.

"When I speak of a control system for planet earth," he says, " I do not want my words to be misunderstood: I do not mean that some higher order of beings has locked us inside the constraints of a space-bound jail, closely monitored by psychic entities we might call angels or demons. I do not propose to redefine God. What I do mean is that mythology rules at a level of our social reality over which normal political and intellectual action has no power…."

Vallee is also coauthor, with J. Allen Hynek, of The Edge of Reality (Regnery, 1975). A resident of the San Francisco area, he is completing a book which further develops his theories concerning UFO phenomena.

We have talked together at some length about his beliefs. The following interview is a report of these conversations:

Clark: Since the great autumn 1973 sighting wave public attitudes about the UFO phenomenon seem to have changed dramatically, to the extent that society may be entering a pivotal period in its perception of the problem. What do you think will happen now?

Vallee: First, I expect increased government and scientific attention to it. More researchers will be pursuing the physical evidence aspects, conducting much more sophisticated investigations of traces left at landing sites and so on. The people moving into the field now are good physicists and good engineers who know what they are doing and who are convinced it is time for them to get involved.

At the same time I expect that public opinion will change also. Initially it probably will move strongly toward the extraterrestrial explanation. Most people see only two ways to look at the problem - either it's all nonsense or we're being visited from outer space. The current spate of movies, books and magazine articles is going to push people toward the extraterrestrial hypothesis. After that I expect a backlash effect may push them in the other direction. I don't know where that's going to leave scientists who want to do research.

Clark: You say that scientists are entering ufology in search of physical evidence. But is there physical evidence? And if there is, are they going to find it? What happens if they don't?

Vallee: If I were speaking for them I would say, "Jerry, it's premature to ask those questions." One doesn't know the answers until one really looks - and so far nobody has looked very seriously. So far the people who have looked have been military types searching for enemy craft or direct threats to national security. Or they've been superficial investigators, dedicated civilians with good training but limited time and limited resources.

But you're asking me what I think. I think there are physical data. They are very, very interesting. They may contain a message. My inclination is to look at the message both in a physical sense and in a symbolic sense, but that's because I'm an information scientist and not a physical scientist. I look for the meaning behind the object.

Let me give you an example of what I mean. Recently Paul Cerny investigated a case in northern California in which two older persons saw a UFO take off. Afterwards they saw a sort of ring on the ground. Within the ring they found some molten metal and a pile of sand.

Obviously here is physical evidence. Two tangible things - the molten metal, which turned out to be brass, and the sand. I took some of the latter to a geologist friend who knows about sand. He said it was highly unusual because it did not contain quartz and it was not stream sand or beach sand or residue from mining or anything else. It seemed to be artificial sand created from grinding together stones of different origin.

Well, to a physicist that may not mean too much. It's an indication of something that turns out to be absurd. We can put it alongside other cases of physical traces and then we may start looking for patterns which might lead us to a better understanding of the modus operandi of whoever's doing all this.

In that sense, yes, there is physical evidence. But if you mean physical evidence in the sense that we're going to discover somebody's propulsion system from it, I would have to say I don't expect that to happen.

Clark: Can we infer from the existence of physical evidence, then, that there is a physical cause?

Vallee: If the UFO phenomenon had no physical cause at all, there would be no way for us to perceive it because human beings are physical entities. So it has to make an impression on our senses somehow. For that to take place, it has to be physical at some time.

Clark: So in other words there is such a thing as a solid, three-dimensional flying saucer.

Vallee: No, I didn't say that. That may or may not be true. I don't think there is such a thing as the flying saucer phenomenon. I think it has three components and we have to deal with them in different ways.

First, there is a physical object. That may be a flying saucer or it may be a projection or it may be something entirely different. All we know about it is that it represents a tremendous quantity of electromagnetic energy in a small volume. I say that based upon the evidence gathered from traces, from electromagnetic and radar detection and from perturbations of the electromagnetic fields such as Dr. Claude Poher, the French space scientist, has recorded.

Second, there's the phenomenon the witnesses perceive. What they tell us is that they've seen a flying saucer. Now they may have seen that or they may have seen an image of a flying saucer or they may have hallucinated it under the influence of microwave radiation, or any of a number of things may have happened. The fact is that the witnesses were exposed to an event and as a result they experienced a highly complex alteration of perception which caused them to describe the object or objects that figure in their testimony.

Beyond there - the physical phenomenon and the perception phenomenon - we have the third component, the social phenomenon. That's what happens when the reports are submitted to society and enter the cultural arena. That's the part which I find most interesting.

Clark: Before we go into that, let's clarify your views on the nature of the physical aspect. When I asked you if there was such a thing as a solid, three-dimensional flying saucer, I was thinking in these terms: Let's suppose that somebody says he has seen a UFO, the bottom part of which was flat and circular. He says he saw the object come down, settle on the soil and then fly off again, leaving a flat circular impression. Doesn't that clearly suggest the presence - at least for the duration of the sighting - of a solid object whose physical structure was more or less as the witness perceived it?

Vallee: Not necessarily. We have evidence that the phenomenon has the ability to create a distortion of the sense of reality or to substitute artificial sensations for the real ones. Look at some of the more bizarre close encounter cases - for example the incident from South America in which one man believed he had been abducted by a UFO while his companion thought he had boarded a bus which had suddenly appeared on the road behind then.

It is conceivable that there is one phenomenon which is visual and another which creates the physical traces. What I'm saying is that a strange kind of deception may be involved.

Clark: In other words the physical traces are placed there as ostensible confirmation of what the senses perceived?

Vallee: Yes. It's comparable perhaps to the strategic deception operations of the British during World War II to fool the Germans. They created artificial tank tracks in the desert and in other ways simulated the passage of large armored divisions. They even caused dust storms to perpetuate the illusion, which the Germans found very convincing indeed.

In the UFO context that might explain cases such as the one in California I mentioned earlier, in which the "physical evidence" left in the wake of the UFO appearance really seemed to have no clear, unambiguous connection with the perceived "object."

Clark: What do you think happens during the "UFO experience?"

Vallee: We don't know. There is no question that something happens. It seems as if an external force takes control of people. In the close encounters people may lose their ability to move or to speak; in the abduction cases, which are the most extreme example, they gradually enter into a series of experiences during which they lose control of all their senses. Do they experience what they think they experience? Suppose you, an outside observer, had been there. What would you have seen?

Clark: I can think of several cases which might suggest I would have seen the same thing they saw. To cite an example, one of the famous Venezuelan humanoid encounters of late 1954 was independently observed by a doctor some distance from the scene.

Vallee: Yes, I'm familiar with that incident and similar ones. But that doesn't alter my point. The doctor may have experienced the object as "real" but we don't know what the nature of that reality is.

We know there are objects that contain a lot of energy in a small space. What do we know about what happens to the human brain when it's exposed to a great deal of energy? We know very little about that. We don't know much about the effects of electromagnetic or microwave radiation on the brain, nor about the effects of pulsating colored lights on the brain. The research into that is just beginning.

What we do know is that you can make people hallucinate using either lights or microwave or electromagnetic energy. You can also make them pass out; you can cause them to behave strangely, put them into shock, make them hear voices or even kill them.

Clark: Is there any way to penetrate to the reality of the experience, for example through hypnotic regression?

Vallee: I'm not sure that what we learn under hypnotic regression is useful. Hypnosis is really a delicate technique and some of the people in our field who are using it are doing more harm than good. If the hypnotist doesn't have medical training - and most of these people have no medical training - the results may be disastrous for the witness. But if the hypnotist does have medical training and doesn't have any knowledge of the subject, he may ask the wrong questions. I think that may have happened in the famous case of Betty and Barney Hill. The hypnotist was extremely skilled but was not especially interested in UFOs and didn't know the background of the problem.

Clark: What can we do, then?

Vallee: I'm not saying that hypnosis has no role to play in UFO investigation, nor that it can't be helpful under certain circumstances when percipients are blocking from their memories something they have seen or experienced.

The thing I really want to emphasize is that the investigator's first responsibility is to the witness and not to the UFO phenomenon. The average witness is in shock because he's had a very traumatic experience; what he's seen is going to change his life. Your intervention, the very fact that you're talking with him about it, is also going to have an effect on him. Now he may say to you, "I need help to understand what I saw," but in fact he needs more immediate help as a human being who is deeply troubled by a very disturbing experience.

Unfortunately this element has been neglected. The more UFO investigators try to appear "professional," the more they ignore that human aspect - and by extension their own ethical obligations. I want to convince my friends in UFO research that whenever we have a choice between obtaining interesting UFO data and taking chances with the life of a human being, we should forget the UFO data.

Another thing to keep in mind is that there are alternatives to the use of hypnosis. These involve putting the percipient into a state of relaxed revery or free association. There are several techniques that are equally as effective as hypnosis in bringing out the hidden details but are must less harmful. Investigators really haven't made use of these yet.

Clark: What do you think of the abduction cases?

Vallee: Again, I'm interested mainly in their symbolic contents.

Let me explain what I mean. We live in a society that is oriented toward technology, so when we see something unusual in the sky we think of it in physical terms. How is it manufactured? What makes it tick? What is its propulsion system? We tend to assume that the physical phenomenon is its most important aspect and that everything else is just a side effect and much less important.

But perhaps we're facing something which is basically a social technology. Perhaps the most important effects from the UFO technology are the social ones and not the physical ones. In other words the physical reality may serve only as a kind of triggering device to provide images for the witness to report. These perceptions are manipulated to create certain kinds of social effects.

If that's true, then the abduction cases are quite revealing. I am not concerned with how many switches there were on the control panel or whether the percipient felt hot or cold when he was inside the flying saucer. Those questions may be totally irrelevant because maybe that person never actually went inside the object.

But the report is extremely important for its symbolic content. It can help us understand what kinds of images are coming through. One might illustrate the difference in this way:

An engineer observing a computer would want to look at the back and open up the boxes. He would want to take a probe and examine the different parts of the computer. But there is another way of looking at it; the way of the programmer, who wants to sit in front of the computer and analyze what it does, not how it does it. That's my approach. I want to ask it questions and see what answers I get. I want to interact with it as an information entity.

In the case of the abductions I think we're dealing with the information aspect. I came to that conclusion because abduction cases, in close encounter cases in general, what the witness is saying is absurd.

Clark: What do you mean?

Vallee: I don't mean simply to imply that the account is silly. I mean it has absurdity as a semantic construction. If you're trying to express something which is beyond the comprehension of a subject, you have to do it through statements that appear contradictory or seem absurd. For example, in Zen Buddhism the seeker must deal with such concepts as "the sound of one hand clapping" - an apparently preposterous notion which is designed to break down ordinary ways of thinking. The occurrences of similar "absurd" messages in UFO cases brought me to the idea that maybe we're dealing with a sort of control system that is subtly manipulating human consciousness.

Clark: But how do you prove that one is operating in a UFO context?

Vallee: I've always been unhappy with the argument between those who believe UFOs are nonsense and those who believe they are extraterrestrial visitors. I don't think I belong in either camp. I've tried to place myself between those two extremes because there's no proof that either proposition is correct. I've come up with the control system concept because it is an idea which can be tested. In that sense it's much closer to a scientific hypotheses than the others. It may turn out that there is a control system which is operated by extraterrestrials. But that's only one possibility.

There are different kinds of control systems - open ones and closed ones - and there are tests you can apply to them to find out what kind of control system you're inside. That leads to a number of experiments you can do with the UFO phenomenon, whereas the other interpretations don't lead you to anything. If you're convinced that UFOs are extraterrestrial, then about the only thing you can do is to climb to a hilltop with a flashlight and send a message in Morse code. People have tried that, I know, but it doesn't seem to work very will!

The control system concept can be tested by a small group of people - you don't need a large organization or a lot of equipment - and you can start thinking about active intervention in the phenomenon.

Clark: How could I prove to my satisfaction that there is a control system in operations?

Vallee: If you think you're inside a control system, the first thing you have to look for is what is being controlled and try to change it to see what happens. My friend Bill Powers proposes the following analogy:

Suppose you're walking through the desert and you see a stone that looks as though it was painted white. A thousand yards later you see another stone of similar appearance. You stop and consider the matter. Either you can forget it or - if you're like me - you can pick up the stone and move it a few feet. If suddenly a bearded character steps out from behind a rock and demands to know why you moved his marker, then you know you've found a control system.

My point is that you can't be sure until you do something. Then you realize that what you were seeing, the thing that looked absurd and incongruous, was really a marker for a boundary that was invisible to everybody else until you discovered it because you looked for a pattern. I think that's exactly what we have to do with UFOs. We have to do something that will cause them to react. And I don't mean building landing strips in the desert and waiting out there to welcome the space brothers.

Clark: But what do you mean?

Vallee: I hesitate to be too specific. I'm speaking, as I'm sure you understand, of the attempted manipulation of UFO manifestations. It's a pretty tall order. We're assuming that there is a feedback mechanism involved in the operations of the control system; if you change the information that's carried back to that system, you might be able to infiltrate it through its own feedback.

Clark: How does one go about investigating UFOs, taking into consideration the possible existence of a control system?

Vallee: You should work outside any organized UFO group. Also you must be very careful about the types of instruments you use for your analysis. For example, I have become increasingly skeptical of the use of computers in UFO research. We're losing a great many data because of a certain situation that is developing: The field researcher will spend a lot of time and money investigating a case. Typically he will write it up in an excellent 10-to-20-page report; then he'll send it to his superiors in the organization, assuming that they are going to put it on the computer and that in this way it's going to add to some great body of knowledge.

But it doesn't. Investigators should understand that their reports go absolutely nowhere. They end up in a drawer somewhere, they are never published, and they're quickly forgotten. All that's left in the computer is a bunch of codes and letters and numbers on magnetic tape somewhere and that's the end of that.

For another thing you don't want to go around chasing every UFO that's reported. If a sighting gets a lot of publicity, you should stay the hell away from it. Instead you should go after cases that you select yourself, ones that have received very little publicity and you've heard about through personal channels. There are plenty of those and they are surprisingly rich in content. You should take your time investigating them. Get involved with the people as human beings. And then you have to become part of the scene, getting as close as you can to what's happening especially if it continues to happen.

Clark: Are you suggesting that the investigator should attempt to experience the phenomenon himself?

Vallee: Yes, I think that's sound scientific practice.

Clark: But isn't that rather dangerous - in the sense that there's a real risk the investigator, even if he is emotionally stable and intellectually sophisticated, might be overwhelmed by the experiences involved?

Vallee: Yes, there are dangers. Witness what happened to Morris Jessup or to Jim McDonald. But I think that now we're more aware of what the dangers are. Once you realize the phenomenon may be deliberately misleading, then you can use certain safeguards. I'm not saying that safeguards are always going to work. There is an element of danger you really can't avoid. There's no way to do that kind of study just by reading books.

It's a little bit like the study of volcanoes. You can learn a lot about them by watching them from a distance but you certainly learn a lot more when you can be right there - even if it's somewhat risky.

http://www.ufoevidence.org/documents/doc608.htm
Brandolini's Bullshit Asymmetry Principle: "The amount of effort necessary to refute bullshit is an order of magnitude bigger than to produce it".

Pavlov probably thought about feeding his dogs every time someone rang a bell.

Offline Buckaroo Banzai

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Re:OVNIs - tópico oficial
« Resposta #165 Online: 04 de Junho de 2017, 21:25:16 »

Citar
Jacques Vallee Discusses UFO Control System

...

Look at some of the more bizarre close encounter cases - for example the incident from South America in which one man believed he had been abducted by a UFO while his companion thought he had boarded a bus which had suddenly appeared on the road behind then.


Offline Gigaview

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Re:OVNIs - tópico oficial
« Resposta #166 Online: 04 de Junho de 2017, 21:48:07 »
Um contato imediato pode ser pessoal/exclusivo para cada um dos contatados e experiência pode ser vivida de modo diferente por cada um, individualmente. Contatar alienígenas pode ser mais fácil do que dominar a telepatia ou a telecinesia, mas exige cuidados especiais e orientação técnica especializada.

Brandolini's Bullshit Asymmetry Principle: "The amount of effort necessary to refute bullshit is an order of magnitude bigger than to produce it".

Pavlov probably thought about feeding his dogs every time someone rang a bell.

Offline Lorentz

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Re:OVNIs - tópico oficial
« Resposta #167 Online: 04 de Junho de 2017, 21:52:56 »
Para quem não conhece o Captain Disillusion:

"Amy, technology isn't intrinsically good or bad. It's all in how you use it, like the death ray." - Professor Hubert J. Farnsworth

Offline Gigaview

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Re:OVNIs - tópico oficial
« Resposta #168 Online: 04 de Junho de 2017, 22:26:47 »
Precisava aquela máscara ridícula de híbrido zeta-reticutiliano pós-moderno?
Brandolini's Bullshit Asymmetry Principle: "The amount of effort necessary to refute bullshit is an order of magnitude bigger than to produce it".

Pavlov probably thought about feeding his dogs every time someone rang a bell.

Offline Gigaview

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Re:OVNIs - tópico oficial
« Resposta #169 Online: 04 de Junho de 2017, 22:57:56 »
Guias de sobrevivência para encontros com animais  perigosos podem inspirar comportamentos defensivos contra formas de vida alienígenas no caso de abdução.


« Última modificação: 04 de Junho de 2017, 23:02:53 por Gigaview »
Brandolini's Bullshit Asymmetry Principle: "The amount of effort necessary to refute bullshit is an order of magnitude bigger than to produce it".

Pavlov probably thought about feeding his dogs every time someone rang a bell.

Offline Lorentz

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Re:OVNIs - tópico oficial
« Resposta #170 Online: 04 de Junho de 2017, 23:25:37 »
Precisava aquela máscara ridícula de híbrido zeta-reticutiliano pós-moderno?

Sim. Na verdade ele é todo cromado, pois é um super heroi. O disfarce é a pintura de tom pele da metade de cima da cabeça.
"Amy, technology isn't intrinsically good or bad. It's all in how you use it, like the death ray." - Professor Hubert J. Farnsworth


Offline Brienne of Tarth

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Re:OVNIs - tópico oficial
« Resposta #172 Online: 08 de Junho de 2017, 14:02:59 »
Eu descobri recentemente que sou descendente dos Reptilianos... :twisted:



"Você pertence a uma das mais populares e temidas espécies alienígenas. Os reptilianos habitam a Terra desde os tempos imemoriais. A sua origem está na constelação de Draco, por isso também são conhecidos como Draconianos. Alguns têm o poder da telepatia (você consegue identificar as intenções das pessoas com facilidade?) e gostam muito de mudar o visual de vez em quando. São muito discretos e bastante apegados à tecnologia." :biglol:

https://seuhistory.com/microsite/invasao-alienigena/news/teste-descubra-seu-dna-alienigena
« Última modificação: 09 de Junho de 2017, 11:25:44 por Brienne of Tarth »
GNOSE

Offline Buckaroo Banzai

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Re:OVNIs - tópico oficial
« Resposta #173 Online: 08 de Junho de 2017, 16:14:28 »
Sou "parente do Drácula"... :/



"Seus antepassados, os Hav-Hannuae-Kondras, deram início à lenda dos vampiros. Eles tinham o hábito de drenar e beber o sangue dos humanos e animais que capturavam em seus passeios pelo planeta. Quem carrega esse DNA muda de humor rapidamente, fala o que dá na telha, arma barraco e faz textão nas redes sociais. Andam frequentemente com um ar preocupado e estão sempre famintos – já terminam o almoço pensando no que vão jantar."

Offline Sergiomgbr

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  • uê?!
Re:OVNIs - tópico oficial
« Resposta #174 Online: 08 de Junho de 2017, 16:20:49 »
Raça dos Highlanderianos. Só restou eu.
Até onde eu sei eu não sei.

 

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